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What knots ??

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What knots ??

Postby Prof » Sat Aug 08, 2009 6:17 pm

Whats your preferred knot for tying braid to your leader !! ):)

For me it's the double uni knot, mainly because it's the only knot I know ?? ::)) ::))

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Re: What knots ??

Postby Scizz » Sat Aug 08, 2009 6:29 pm

m8 i use a bimini double in the braid and a standard leader knot,not sure what its called but with this knot you can re-use you double if you do a leader and it is a very low profile knot so it goes through the guides easily.i will show you next time i see you.
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Re: What knots ??

Postby dan23 » Sat Aug 08, 2009 7:54 pm

Bimini to my own variation of the albright. The knot strength is incredible. I've often tied this leader knot with a heavier leader than the mainline and the vast majority of the time the leader will break before the mainline! I actually find tying the bimini really helps get knots through guides as well. I have found a lot of the problems with knots catching on guides are actually the difference between the diameter of mainline and leader. Doubling the mainline really does help things go through more smoothly.

One important tip is that once you have tied the albright pull on the leader and the leader tag till they are at 180 degrees. This will snug the knot up. After doing this then pull on the leader and the mainline to finally pull any leader that might slip through the knot. Once you've done this you can cut off the leader tag extremely close to the knot so that it runs through the guides and won't catch. Hope that makes sense.

Double uni is ok but I have tested it next to the above configuration and there really is no comparison in knot confidence.
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Re: What knots ??

Postby Prof » Sat Aug 08, 2009 9:15 pm

Is this the Albright you are talking about ??


Albright-knotdb.jpg
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Re: What knots ??

Postby dan23 » Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:06 pm

Yeah prof that is it but I go back around and through the hole twice before tightening it up. Some guys do equal wraps up and down the leader but I don't.
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Re: What knots ??

Postby Feral » Sun Aug 09, 2009 1:59 pm

Thats what they call the improved albright Prof, I use it for everything, never had a problem from 4lb leader through to 80lb.

I usually do 8 up and 7 back.
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Re: What knots ??

Postby Paulus » Tue Aug 11, 2009 10:44 pm

Hey guys

Interesting watching these knot discussions.

Braid to leader is interesting as i used to use a double hangmans uni, but it fails compared to an improved double blood. and an albright will impact and cut the leader over time, so the next cast you will see your lure well ahead of your line.

Lets look at all this in stages.

First before you make the braid to leader join, iron out the braid, that is run it through your thumb nail and fore finger 4 times turn it over and do the same, this is to flatten it out and widen it, this spreads the load over a wider area, then fold the braid in the knot to add bulk and further soften and spread the load onto the leader.

Now that has been done lets talk about knots.

Braid on softer leaders will have better knot strength than on harder leaders, less impacting by better stretch and shockability, as will have much longer leaders.

With softer leaders the braid beds in and is supported by the leader material conforming, so better strength.

Harder leaders do not form and conform well so the braid cuts it's self at a point, at some stage within the join the braid crosses its self and cuts, this is because it sits on a hard base, now with a longer leader that is a better shocker this is not as bad as with a shorter one, as it will impact less.

Note:- the following is with tested line.

Take a 15 lb braid and a 10 lb medium hardness leader, the leader in this join should break at 9.5 lb, then go to a 15 lb leader and the leader should break at 14 or so lb, now go to a 20 lb leader and the main line (braid) will fail at 12 lb.
Note:- we started going backwards. When the leader goes beyond the breaking strain of the main line (braid) we need to support it with a double in the main line (braid), that is sharing and the spreading the load over 2 legs.
So in comes the Bimini twist, now this tied well is great, but tying it well is another story, as a lot fail at 60% of the braids strength, If it slips within it's self even less, so no advantage.

Just a few questions at the end,,,
Why use a leader at all, well,,,,,, better knot ability to a terminal than braid, to take up the shock loading that the Braid has not got, this load is then loaded onto the rod, and then onto the drag (which is not designed to do it hence the word drag) which is not a shocker or absorber,,,, so why are we using a so called FC hard leader which has poor all of these things, worst of all they are used short.
Let's not forget abrasion resistance which braid has little of, but then how much do you need???.

Try a medium hardness leader and 2 rod lengths long and you will do better, with your overall knot strength.
Now don't forget about the pulling of hooks, in all this.

A few variables to take into consideration, smaller tighter weaved braids with greater breaking strains may not do as well in braid to leader knots, as they cut better, and what ever you do never let them slip.
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Re: What knots ??

Postby Feral » Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:45 am

I've also seen a couple of pro barra fishermen using 80lb fireline in the dark gray colour as leader. They swear buy it because it cuts through weed whilst normal leader will not.
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Re: What knots ??

Postby Prof » Wed Aug 12, 2009 7:53 am

Thanx for the info guys I will give it a go!!

Paulus, very detailed info there mate, like the idea of flattening the braid!

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Re: What knots ??

Postby Paulus » Mon Aug 24, 2009 8:54 pm

Hey Guys,

I heard a little about a knot called a FG knot, it had me intrigued, so i looked it up, to give it a go.
I used 23 lb Whiplash pro braid and 50 lb Sunline FC leader
After tying one i could have done 10 allbrights and 8 double bloods, but some use them.
Testing it was a little bit of a surprise as it, the knot pulled apart, the braid separated at 1/2 the test lb of the braid, and popped off the leader, so I tied another.
It needs to be pulled up very tight as it is being tied.
The second test again, as the braid tensions up it embeds into the leader, this allows the loops within the knot to separate, this then gives room for the loops to pop off, this knot does allow the braid to tension up on the leader but it allows the separation of the loops, the braid broke at 50% of it's test value.
This looked like a good knot, but it's not for me, must be better about.
The next Knot is a GT i heard about that to.
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Re: What knots ??

Postby pink nipper » Tue Aug 25, 2009 10:25 am

For braid to leader -

I started a few years back with a 5 turn Surgeons Knot but also first twisting the braid around the leader prior
to doing the 5 turn knot. This knot had to be properly tested each time one was tied as it did slip sometimes
but generally did the job.

I progressed to the Double Uni Knot as it gives much more consistant results for each knot tied and can also be tied out on a boat with wind and swell etc.
As with most knots it does have some impact when casting through the guides on the rod especially if you are using heavier leader material.

Lately I have been using The Slim Beauty and so far am still impressed. The trimmed knot ends face backwards away from the guides so
when casting there is minimal impact on the knot running through the guides of the rod, and the knot has good strength.
(Will include a picture of this knot courtesy of Geoff Wilson's Encyclopedia of Fishing Knots and Rigs) :thumbup:

One day I'll progress to a bimini double connected to an improved albright leader knot but I can't tie 'em consistantly especially when
out on a boat in any sort of wind and swell... :problem:

My 10 cents worth... :wink:

Nip.
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Re: What knots ??

Postby Paulus » Sat Aug 29, 2009 6:53 pm

Hi Nip
Most of the time the double uni is a very quick knot to do, but improved double blood works better, thats until you get to the heavier leaders, then they both fall in a hole. You just need those two legs to spread the load.

I am just starting to do knot reviews on my site.
I will get to the slim beauty. I have started on a knot of my own just need to develop it a little further.

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Re: What knots ??

Postby Paulus » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:10 pm

Hey Guys
A little bit of work on this,

Image

It's basically 8 to 10 turns of each leg around the leader, it's slim and very strong.
The harder the leader the more turns it needs.
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Re: What knots ??

Postby snaps » Fri Nov 27, 2009 8:58 am

ive been useing the slim Beauty its a great knot as i use 30lb braid with 60lb leader the slim Beauty is still small enough to go through your guides :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
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Re: What knots ??

Postby bettaman » Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:07 pm

Im loving the albright knot, such an easy knot. I was using berkley vanish, breaking strength was crap. I was using double uni knots and would always break at the knot. Not sure if it was cutting through the leader.

I tried the albright knot and it seems to spread out the pressure across a larger portion of the line.
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